Bard's Tale IV - Spotlight #2 - Combat

[JDR13]

I haven't even been talking about PoE. In general, the assumption that choices in an RPG can be too balanced is idiotic and holds no weight whatsoever.

It's simple. RPGs are all about choices. A good RPG should offer you multiple choices that are fun and balanced. There's absolutely no such thing as choices being too balanced, and there's nothing positive about an RPG that gives you superior choices and inferior choices.

It's obvious that you just don't get what some people are saying here, and you're not even making an attempt to understand. You're just repeating your opinion over and over again and trying to argue with everyone who doesn't agree with you. Give it a rest.

 

[Copper Coin]

I am making an attempt to understand. Do you understand why only having the choice between superior and inferior options is crap game design?

Wolfing says himself that an RPG can be heavily balanced, but not necessarily have dull choices. If that's true, then there's no such thing as choices being too balanced.

Game designers should strive to make choices in RPGs both balanced and interesting.

 

[JDR13]

I understand perfectly that that's your opinion.

One of these days, maybe you'll learn to distinguish the difference between objective facts and what's merely your own opinion. You seem to struggle with differentiating between the two.

 

[Kordanor]

Hrm, I think he has a point, though maybe "balancing" is not the best description.

I'd go with the example of Torment: Tides of Numera. You could argue that it is perfectly balanced. Because no matter what you do, every choice, everything you do is equal to what you don't do.
The outcome of tying to pick a herb and succeeding and trying to pick a herb and failing is "perfectly balanced". Both gives you an advantage.
The game mechanics in that game absolutely do not matter, as no matter what you do, it might matter in the story a bit, but not in the actual gameplay.

And because all of the game mechanics were meaningless, there were no good or bad decisions it felt boring to me.

But that's also not "perfect balancing" but also hiding badly that your choice and your success doesn't matter.

A quest reward of:
Helm: STR+1
OR
Helm: ToHit+1 and Crit+1

might be more interesting than:
Mirror: Worth 100 Gold
Neclace: Worth 100 Gold
You can hand them in and for the 100 Gold receive a Helm with STR+1, the other Helm doesnt exist.

The second option is "balanced" better, as it's basically not balancing anything at all.

I think what JDR13 means with perfect balancing is that you actually have the choice between two things, and they are perfectly balanced, but only if you have some kind of plan or idea. Or it changes the way you can play. Chose a bow to kill your enemy from afar, or a dagger to backstab it.
In both cases you should be able to beat your opponent. But your choice will decide on how you have to play. And if you have learnt a skill to shoot arrows but not one to use a dagger well, than yeah, it doesn't need to be "perfectly balanced" and you are allowed to have a hard time if you chose the dagger nevertheless.

 

[Copper Coin]

Chose a bow to kill your enemy from afar, or a dagger to backstab it.
In both cases you should be able to beat your opponent. But your choice will decide on how you have to play.

That's what I'm advocating for. I just don't think one playstyle choice should be inferior to the other, because at the end of the day it's still a roleplaying game. Players shouldn't be negatively impacted gameplaywise based on their roleplaying decisions.

In the case of attributes specifically, you shouldn't be punished for choosing a playstyle that doesn't involve min/maxing like in D&D. Attributes should be set up so that they're important to all characters, and there's a price to pay if you dump one.

 

[Copper Coin]

This is why I prefer classless RPGs though, because they're usually better in this regard.

 

[wolfing]

Guess I'm old school, but I want melee weapon damage to depend on Strength, magic damage to depend on intelligence, and ranged damage to depend on Dexterity. I don't want a 'inner strength' stat that applies to all weapons, I don't want my mage to grab a sword and do more damage with it than my warrior.

 

[Kordanor]

Guess I'm old school, but I want melee weapon damage to depend on Strength, magic damage to depend on intelligence, and ranged damage to depend on Dexterity. I don't want a 'inner strength' stat that applies to all weapons, I don't want my mage to grab a sword and do more damage with it than my warrior.

No worries. The mage won't be able to equip a sword.