Dragon Age: Inquisition - On Critics of Dorian

[bjon045]

Thank god we have larian, obsidian, inxile etc to pick up the mantle. Bioware has focused so far in the wrong direction and the quality of their games are really suffering for it.

 

[ChienAboyeur]

But - Bioware should REALLY push the envelope and include characters which are

- autistic
- borderliners
- depressive
- having Synaestesia
- are highly intellectually gifted
- handicapped (a missing leg or arm)
- deaf

etc. - including characters with other sexual orientations should only the beginning.

If they want to push the enveloppe, they must disregard any of this, do not think of including but making their hero whoever they can be.

The main hurtle to this is that among the players who want to associate closely to their avatar, nobody is more vocal than the dominant side, the side that keeps being represented in every single game. As soon as they do not see themselves in the game, they turn massively vocal.

Make the hero a borderliner etc, pushing out the usual representation of the hero, let it take the place of the main stream image of the hero, this is when they push the enveloppe.
Here, it is just a marketing trick to expand the customer base by appealing to minor groups while preserving the interests of the major customer core.

Smoke and mirrors.

 

[JDR13]

So why should romances be kept out? Because shallow quest givers and henchmen are a well established concept in RPGs and romances are not? I think that would be wrong.

Of course there are prople who don't pursue romances in RPGs, so any of the developer's invested resources are wasted from their point of view. But same goes for other concepts as well. I don't like crafting for example and avoid it as far as possible. That's wasted resources for me. But that's the way it is and I don't complain. There's hardly any game where I really like all and every feature. And I think that goes for everybody.

The difference is that romance is something you can do in real life, and I think that's a major reason why many people don't care to see it in an RPG. I think the majority of people play games to do things they can't do for real.

Henchmen, quests, deadly combat … those are things we don't get to experience in real life. If I want to get laid, I'll go to a bar. I don't need to do that in a video game.

Thank god we have larian, obsidian, inxile etc to pick up the mantle. Bioware has focused so far in the wrong direction and the quality of their games are really suffering for it.

Amen.

 

[zahratustra]

The difference is that romance is something you can do in real life, and I think that's a major reason why many people don't care to see it in an RPG. I think the majority of people play games to do things they can't do for real.

You are GROSSLY overestimating the pulling power of an average RPG player JD :lol:

 

[JDR13]

You are GROSSLY overestimating the pulling power of an average RPG player JD :lol:

That's probably true.

 

[zahratustra]

Have you been playing DA: O, DA2 or ME2?

 

[azarhal]

Have you been playing DA: O, DA2 or ME2?

You should have started with KoTOR...

KoTOR had a lesbian romance (Juhani)
Jade Empire had 2 bisexual romances (male/female)

They have been including those for over 10 years now.

 

[Damian]

I dont mind gay characters, its just when they are forced into a sexual relationship; just by being their friend, I am looking at you Anders.

 

[zahratustra]

errrr you are aware that cursing is also Haraam DN? Or you just pick which rules you obey and which you don't have to?

 

[joxer]

For god's sakes…

After so many years on this forum this is the first time I'm seeing here someone who despises minorities and is hiding his rotten heart under some religion.

Noone forces you to play Dragon Age games. Go find yourself another game and continue with whimper about your terrible fate elsewhere.

There is a right place for you, a forum here (man, I can't believe I'm posting this link):
http://rpgcodex.com

 

[zahratustra]

Could't have put it better myself joxer.

 

[Morrandir]

Unlike you Christian people…

Who exactly might these Christians be?

Just because I'm a Muslim doesn't mean that I shouldn't be able to enjoy video games without feeling insulted.

Right, you shouldn't be able to enjoy video games like these. Not because you're a Muslim, but because you're (as far as I can tell from these few postings) a narrow-minded fool.

 

[purpleblob]

Unlike you Christian people

That just shows you are a closed minded fool. You take your religion seriously so you insult people with other faith. Way to go!

I don't mind romances in game (regardless of the gender preferences) so long as it's not forced on to me/my characters. Although I agree bioware's focus these days has been on "romances" rather than the game itself (story, meaningful character development, quests, combat etc).

 

[joxer]

Did it ever occur to you that the only one spreading propaganda is you?

Sorry, but I just can't be arsed to read more that crap. Starting now, you're on my ignorelist.

 

[Couchpotato]

Alright time for me to step in as I said keep it civil, and have moderated a few posts from this thread. So once again play nice or have your posts deleted.

 

[Sidion]

I respect everyone's opinion (mostly) but some I don't get at all. At all. The posters wondering why there aren't more "vertically challenged" people represented in games or people with specific disabilities or mental illness? Huh? There are a maximum of about 100,000 dwarfs in the entire population. Also the same for disabilities like down syndrome, etc. I think ideally there should be more representation in games for these groups and hopefully technology where get there where customizability will allow people to play any kind of character they want. And comparing mental illness to things like race, gender, sexual orientation is just… Wat.

There are 100 million gay people worldwide at the very lowest estimate. It's likely twice that are higher, and that's not including bisexual people. Taking it all together it could be as high as 10%, 1 in ten people.

I don't want this to be a wall of text post so I'll keep it short. For 20 years I've been a gamer, sat through heterosexual flirting, implied romances, and explicit romances in most games. We could put a list here of hundreds of games for the past 20 years and longer that have these (i.e. Final Fanstasy series, Alan Wake, KotOR, Uncharted series, Metal Gear Solid, Super Mario Bros series, Witcher series and on and on). It did nothing for me at all. And sometimes it was awkward. But suddenly Bioware allows an option for gay characters who are clearly and openly gay and options for gay romances and suddenly "It's too much! Games are games, they don't need romances and flirting!" Oh really now. Where were these people for the past 20 years? This has been happening ever since text-based games… Although in past games instead of a sex scene there was a fade-to-black. Besides that nothing much as changed except now there are gay characters and Bioware has options for different kinds of people. That's the big woop? Can I please get my 20 years of story/fictional flirting, implied romance, and explicit romance for gay characters too? I don't think anyone is being forced to actually play a gay character unlike me, who has been playing straight characters for a little bit of time here.

 

[Stingray]

Where were these people for the past 20 years?

Many of us, 20 years ago, were right where we are now - not wanting romances in our games, period. Actually seems to be the majority opinion on RPGWatch. The only difference now is that they're making them even more awkward for the vast majority of us (minimum of 90% by your own numbers).

BTW, you joined the forum just to post this misdirected rant?

 

[Damian]

For some reason I thought that the hate was aimed at me until i read the quoted text on another post further down. Is there a way to ban them or silence them without deleting their post so we can follow dialogue?

 

[DArtagnan]

I think my problem with this Bioware obsession is that it seems to be their number one priority - and gameplay, depth, quality of writing and so on are all of much lower priority.

If the games themselves were great, like the old Bioware games, I wouldn't mind them obsessing over everyone fucking everyone in the name of equality. Just as long as the characters and the writing supported it, that is.

 

[Fluffyhotep]

Well, diversity seems to have become a big thing with BioWare, to a point where I am beginning to suspect it’s part conviction, part marketing.

It wasn’t as noticeable in DA:O, which had one bisexual sexy assassin-bard-nun (Leliana), and no (convincingly) non-white characters. BioWare actually received quite a bit of flak concerning the last point, including on BSN.

So now we are three months away from the next Dragon Age game. We have, out of 9 playable Companion and three non-playable advisor NPC’s:
Two confirmed homosexuals (Dorian and Sera)
One possible bisexual (Iron Bull)
Three humans ‘of colour’, as they say in the USA or ‘visible minorities’ in Canada (Vivienne, Dorian – supposed to be ‘Indian’ in real-world phenotypical terms and finally a yet-unnamed ‘black’ ‘scribe’ advisor NPC)

I think the socio-political statement BioWare is making through their character design is clear.
In principle I’m sympathetic towards it, but I do get this weird vibe that it’s been ‘squeezed in’ as much as they could, given that Thedas is mostly a fairly generic pseudo-European setting. Almost as if they are trying to over-compensate for the first game’s ‘shortcomings’ in terms of diversity.
I also get the feeling it’s done with a strong focus on the US market and the debates regarding race and sexual orientation there; as far as I know it’s not as big an issue in Canada and Europe (though not absent).

Then again, this whole situation should not, and probably will not, have any direct impact on the quality of the game. And maybe it will have some actual positive impact.