The Kitchen Drawer

[dteowner]

Well, if we're resorting to italics, I think it's worth pointing out the parts I wrote before and after the bit you cropped out:

No, my disdain rests on a sustained pattern of behavior that leads me to draw the conclusion that this is not someone posting in a good faith and serious way - it has nothing to do with proving a negative. I'm saying that I think engaging with these shenanigans is not likely to lead to any kind of sensible conversation.

... bit you quoted ...

What's being peddled here is a tired and debunked antivax playbook, and engaging with it will get you nowhere. If someone seriously wants to determine the risks of a new vaccine (or any medicine), they need to listen to the signal, not the noise.

I'm trying to make it clear that my problem is with this particular instance, because of the pattern I believe to be trolling in several threads (last week it was 'Kanye for President'). Of course I'm not saying that the statement "we cannot know the very long term effects of a vaccine produced two years ago" is trolling, because it's an obviously true statement that a reasonable person might make in the course of a good faith conversation. But, IMO, this is not that, and that impression is compounded by the use of well-known antivaxxer shenanigans.

If there were sensible folks that wanted to have a real discussion about the vaccines and evidence of any harm, that would be fine by me - I'm not interested in shutting down honest debate. I just think it's very hard to have that sensible discussion unless folks can filter out the flat-Earth, fractal bullshit element.

Yeah, I tried to italicize one word using BB codes because I'm old and a creature of habit. The board software (understandably) didn't appreciate that. Did a quick edit and it would appear that totally stuffed it up. Sorry.

Anyhoo, I get what you're saying, but it seems to be cheating a bit. While you might compartmentalize your opinions to specific posters, your words don't really make any such distinctions. So while in your head there's an implied, "that particular person there", the actual words generalize to equating anyone that questions vax with Flat Earthers et al.

 

[Ripper]

Anyhoo, I get what you're saying, but it seems to be cheating a bit. While you might compartmentalize your opinions to specific posters, your words don't really make any such distinctions. So while in your head there's an implied, "that particular person there", the actual words generalize to equating anyone that questions vax with Flat Earthers et al.

Well, I don't see it as 'cheating' on my part - I see it as me making one point, and you interpreting it as another. But fair enough - I think that's an honest disagreement.

Just with regard to the trolling game (if I am correct), we should always be cautious of them sowing discord between us. To get the community arguing amongst itself over their nonsense is the chef's kiss.

 

[Stingray]

We're talking about OverIt, right? He has 288 posts on RPGWatch, all but 3 of them are in this forum, and those 3 weren't particularly interesting or insightful. A lot of what he posts is pretty obviously uninformed, and I say that despite agreeing with his sentiments on a lot of issues. I don't see much reason to engage with someone who came to this site purely to stir shit up. But the old Chien Aboyeur situation shows that people probably won't stop biting

 

[OverIt]

We're talking about OverIt, right? He has 288 posts on RPGWatch, all but 3 of them are in this forum, and those 3 weren't particularly interesting or insightful. A lot of what he posts is pretty obviously uninformed, and I say that despite agreeing with his sentiments on a lot of issues. I don't see much reason to engage with someone who came to this site purely to stir shit up. But the old Chien Aboyeur situation shows that people probably won't stop biting

Eh, what kind of rpgs i want to talk about doesnt seem to be of interest here. No one here really wants to talk about Path of Exile each season, Conan Exiles, 7 days to die, or Ark. And i tend not to engage in doom and glooming rpgs, like Baldurs Gate 3 which i find awful despite loving DOS2.

As for uninformed what exactly have i said that is uninformed, i mean how am i supposed to learn if people dont tell me where i am misinformed so i can check to see if i am in the wrong here? I am mainly here for pushback on my side of the isle(ie right wing) so i can learn.

 

[dteowner]

Well, I don't see it as 'cheating' on my part - I see it as me making one point, and you interpreting it as another. But fair enough - I think that's an honest disagreement.

Just with regard to the trolling game (if I am correct), we should always be cautious of them sowing discord between us. To get the community arguing amongst itself over their nonsense is the chef's kiss.

Discord? Shit, no worries there. I'm just taking another turn with my painfully overused and only mildly constructive "mind that you don't step in that pile of hypocrisy" soapbox. Not a ruffled feather to be found.

 

[Zloth]

So about this Santos thing... Not the fact that he lied. Not the fact that the Republicans aren't real interested in giving him the boot for it because the race was a close one. (I've got no doubt they would drum the guy out if they could be sure another Republican would win.) What worries me is the fact that almost nobody figured it out until after the election!

This kind of thing has happened before, but they tend to get discovered when the primaries are happening or maybe right after - which immediately results in the liar's party booting him and giving the nomination to somebody else before the ballots are finalized. This joker got all the way through the election before somebody bothered to look to see if he really graduated from where he said, worked where he said, and owned the mansion he said!

According to the Washington Post, though, a small local news source did figure it out. They broke the story and, instead of it getting verified and reported by bigger publications, nobody even seemed to notice.

Whatever the reasons, the media really dropped the ball. Social Media influencers aren't about to take the time to do that kind of investigation. Traditional media at the local and even regional level is barely there at all now. The fact that a guy can lie that blatantly and get away with it for so long is a bad, bad sign of the times.

Not a ruffled feather to be found.

Well yeah, you aren't using the avatar with feathers anymore!

 

[Stingray]

So about this Santos thing... Not the fact that he lied. Not the fact that the Republicans aren't real interested in giving him the boot for it because the race was a close one. (I've got no doubt they would drum the guy out if they could be sure another Republican would win.)

No, they wouldn't, there's no justification for booting him out of the House. Only 5 people have ever been expelled from the House (coincidentally all Democrats): 3 for treason (fighting for the Confederacy) and 2 for being convicted of taking bribes. Bullshitting about your resume/background isn't on the same level. Best they could reasonably do is try to convince him to resign.

I agree with your main point though, pretty crazy that (almost) nobody in the press can even be bothered to verify basic background claims.

 

[SveNitoR]

No, they wouldn't, there's no justification for booting him out of the House. Only 5 people have ever been expelled from the House (coincidentally all Democrats): 3 for treason (fighting for the Confederacy) and 2 for being convicted of taking bribes. Bullshitting about your resume/background isn't on the same level. Best they could reasonably do is try to convince him to resign.

I agree with your main point though, pretty crazy that (almost) nobody in the press can even be bothered to verify basic background claims.

Maybe the press is busy making money by controversy, and propping up the powerful, instead of acting as a control mechanism of the powerful?

I know that's the case with some media in Sweden and it is really bad that these news sources get called news at all.

Some journalists have tried to start a youtube channel or something similar, but the serious ones don't get traffic. The ones who reach a large audience are the bullshitters and egocentric drama queens.

 

[OverIt]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1608813140074201089

View: https://twitter.com/DVATW/status/1608813140074201089


Now the WHO is saying you should be giving boosters to the elderly in other poorer countries and not killing children with them. How long before it will be just using it only on the elderly.

 

[Zloth]

Best they could reasonably do is try to convince him to resign.

Yeah, which is exactly what they do. He gets excluded from all strategy meetings, gets 0 committee appointments, the House overwhelmingly condemns him... I wouldn't be surprised if they put tacks on his chair every time he got up. He still gets to vote on bills, but that's absolutely it. Meanwhile, his constituents work on a recall. Most people abdicate pretty fast.

 

[dteowner]

Although it calls into question the guy's integrity, remember that a 4 year degree is not a requirement of the position. Given the way things [don't] work in Congress, evidence of being capable of higher thought might actually be a detriment. Further, given the state of the Ivory Tower these days, it would probably be challenging for anyone but a hard left zealot to emerge without psychological trauma and the whole "higher thought" thing might be wishful thinking.

 

[Stingray]

Yeah, which is exactly what they do. He gets excluded from all strategy meetings, gets 0 committee appointments, the House overwhelmingly condemns him... I wouldn't be surprised if they put tacks on his chair every time he got up. He still gets to vote on bills, but that's absolutely it. Meanwhile, his constituents work on a recall. Most people abdicate pretty fast.

Recalling a member of Congress isn’t possible.

 

[Zloth]

Recalling a member of Congress isn’t possible.

Oh, you're right! Well, at any rate, people who have both parties turn solidly against them don't seem to last long. I guess we'll see if times have changed.

 

[Ripper]

Lol, that one really is a piece of work. I sometimes look these things up on Fox News - if they're not having it, you know it's bad. He's the most pathetic worm on a hook I've seen for a while.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3sC1Ha2JwU

 

[JDR13]

"Naughty Santos!" "We here at Fox have far too much integrity to tolerate such behavior!"