RPGWatch Feature: Elemental Review

BTW, for those of you pining for MoM you can get it from GOG for $5. It works on 64 bit Windows, too! I struggled getting my old copy to work a while back under XP and gave up so it was worth the $5 to get a good copy that runs just fine.
 
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BillSeurer said:
BTW, for those of you pining for MoM you can get it from GOG for $5. It works on 64 bit Windows, too! I struggled getting my old copy to work a while back under XP and gave up so it was worth the $5 to get a good copy that runs just fine.
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Yep it sure does.
Gog.com is a gift from a god ;)
 
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Quote from Brad:

(I'm up north on vacation typing on an extremely slow connection so bear with me)

I don't think people yet fully realize the completeness of Stardock's fail on Elementa's launch.

I'm going to write more about this but not only did we think v1.05 was ready for everyone but we felt v1.0 was too. That's the level of disconnect/poor judgment on our part we're talking about.

If the game had come out in February, it would still have been a disastrous launch because lack of time wasn't the issue. It was blindness, sheer blindness. We felt the game was finished. And I speak of v1.0, not v1.05. Blindness.

There will be massive consequences for Stardock's game studio. I'll be talking more about this when I get back. But the game wasn't released early. The game was released poorly. Head in the sand syndrome imo. I've read the reviews as much as possible given my hideous internet access up here and I agree with them. We just didn't see what they were talking about. We thought any complaints would be about polish points or something.

The point is, the issue here is far far worse than many of you think it is. I wish it was an issue of the game being released too early. That's an easy thing for a company to "fix". Elemental's launch is the result of catastrophic poor judgment on my part.

EVERY competent software developer knows that the programmer must never be the one deciding whether the program is done. Yet, my love of Elemental broke my self discipline and I began coding on the game itself in vast amounts and lost any sense of objectivity on where the game's state was. I normally only program the AI on our games so I can keep a level of distance from the game itself to determine whether it's "Ready". On Elemental, I was in love with the world and the game and lost my impartiality.

We'll do better.

Seems he wised up, which is good. That means I can shut up.

It also means people can stop being delusional, and the game can start being fixed up proper - without illusions getting in the way.

I'm pleased, and I'm impressed that Brad is man enough to come forward and realise this.
 
SveNitoR said:
I've lurked the Stardock forums since the launch of GalCiv2. Never saw Frogboy say something like that (other than lashing out now and then when discussions got out of hand). Got any quotes to back it up?
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He was too careful at that time to do that. It was private communications, in particular when myself and others (who's emails I saw) asked for my money back. Re GalCiv2, remember the much touted 'learning AI', never there. (No I am not going to post private correspondance it won't help the situation.)

BTW I bought Elemental hoping it was better, ah well. (Yes I have followed them and purchsed their games for a long time, even the original OS/2 GalCiv for which I was a Beta tester, his attitude IMHO has never changed this time it is just a bit more obvious.)
 
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I'm glad to see that comment from Brad and I can continue to respect him as a CEO and wish more companies were willing to be this upfront with customers. Frequently we would get silence or a blame game of publisher blaming developer or vice versa.

Still wondering what the next steps will actually be but I expect that they will be working on this game for a while to bring it up to a better standard. Now hoping CiV will be a worthy release.
 
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Yeah, I take this to be sincere - though it's scary how blind he has been.

I'm afraid they would need a new designer, or at least the current lead designer to be able to "overrule" Brad, for this to become a great game.

Somehow, I doubt Brad can leave it alone - and I fear he's simply not capable of creating a game that can compare to MoM/AoW - SM. The problem with Elemental is not the bugs, as all games have them.

The core issue is that the overall design is VERY weak - because none of the features have been given enough thought. They're way too bare-bones, and a complete redesign is really what's needed.

Then again, we have the community… It will just take a long time.
 
So Brad has admitted he shouldn't be doing the programmer/CEO thing at the same time. He can't exactly remove all the work he's done on the game.. so the only other option is for someone else to take over the decision making regarding Elemental. Has he suggested they will do this or who that might be?
 
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kalniel said:
So Brad has admitted he shouldn't be doing the programmer/CEO thing at the same time. He can't exactly remove all the work he's done on the game.. so the only other option is for someone else to take over the decision making regarding Elemental. Has he suggested they will do this or who that might be?
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He hasn't been specific about anything, yet.

It's clear that he sees a big issue, but judging from other posts from him, since the above quoted one - he still seems to think Elemental is "potentially fantastic".

That's like saying a shell with good tools is "potentially fantastic", and as such - he's right.

But you need a fantastic designer to make use of that potential, and frankly, Brad isn't the one.

Should be said, though, that it's my subjective opinion. I always thought GalCiv (both of them) were bland and boring - even if the AI is impressive. I think they lack flavor and "soul" - and it takes a certain kind of designer to achieve those rather intangible things.

Maybe he should hire Steve Barcia ;)
 
Interesting… SD has just posted a very comprehensive list of problems with Elemental. They went far beyond their own internal assessments. The list includes significant feedback from many non-SD forums and reviews.

RPGwatch readers will be intrigued to see that you were part of it. The RPGwatch review, and comments in this attached thread, were quoted in the summary several times.

http://forums.elementalgame.com/394530

Now we wait and see if the follow-up on patches to address this list is equal to the candor in posting it.
 
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DArtagnan said:
Quote from Brad:

(I'm up north on vacation typing on an extremely slow connection so bear with me)

I don't think people yet fully realize the completeness of Stardock's fail on Elementa's launch.

I'm going to write more about this but not only did we think v1.05 was ready for everyone but we felt v1.0 was too. That's the level of disconnect/poor judgment on our part we're talking about.

If the game had come out in February, it would still have been a disastrous launch because lack of time wasn't the issue. It was blindness, sheer blindness. We felt the game was finished. And I speak of v1.0, not v1.05. Blindness.
Click to expand...


How could you possibly consider something where major elements are simply not working (multiplayer, according to the review) as finished?
 
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wynams said:
After 100 hours (incl 50+ this weekend) I am going the "request refund" route.
This was my first Stardock purchase (tried GalCiv but was more a MoO guy), and I definitely will wait for a demo for any future SD games. This game is not immersive, not fun, ever turn is a resilience test to go onwards.

ATK/DEF too generic to be used for melee, ranged and magic (MoM got this right, EWoM not so much). SD dev: "I'm starting to think that squads having DEF equal to (individual unit DEF * NumberOfTroops) is a mistake." http://forums.stardock.com/392831/page/4/#2738296

There aren't any undead or flying creatures in a 4x Fantasy RPG?

MP not implemented and even when it is, you will have to connect through SD servers (no p2p).

As unpolished as this game is, it is even more imbalanced.

Good thing Age of Wonders is coming soon to steam! I need my 4x strat fix around this time of the year.
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Apparently getting a refund was not enough for this guy, he is definately not alright with Stardock....he has decided that not only was he entitled to 100 hours of play time, but trolling the forums afterwords is his forte. Class act.
 
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rune_74 said:
Apparently getting a refund was not enough for this guy, he is definately not alright with Stardock….he has decided that not only was he entitled to 100 hours of play time, but trolling the forums afterwords is his forte. Class act.
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Why wouldn't he be entitled after having bought the game?

About his dissatisfaction, I don't see much difference between that - and your blind loyality.

It's equally constructive, I'd say. Actually, he seems to have good points - so he's being more constructive.
 
DArtagnan said:
Why wouldn't he be entitled after having bought the game?

About his dissatisfaction, I don't see much difference between that - and your blind loyality.

It's equally constructive, I'd say. Actually, he seems to have good points - so he's being more constructive.
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continued posting in childish manner....yeah thats helpful.

Blind loyalty? how am I being blindly loyal?

You see no issues in a guy playing a game for 100 hours(no one does that if they hate something to the point they want a refund) then deciding trolling the forums is the way to go.

Not much point in discussing with someone like you though, you are one of those people who argues for the sake of arguing. Weird bizzaro internet world for you I guess.
 
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