Fallout 3 - Details Emerge

[bjon045]

I can fully agree with you about Dr.Strange Love, for example. However, I feel uneasy with the reference to the factual name.

What on earth are you talking about?!?!?! It is the name of a weapon nothing more.

Should all games be prohibited from using weapons called "AK-47's"? AK-47's have killed far more people than "fatman" did.

Ludicrous argument.

Then explain to me exactly why he make a 200-year old car "mushroom" into a very limited (?) nuclear explosion. It makes no sense.

I can't really understand what you have written here but I think I understand where you are coming from and I am sure it wouldn't be that hard to come up with an explanation. Removing the cooling system would probably cause a pretty big explosion, although I am sure that would be a lot of work as they would have safeguards to prevent the cooling system from being damaged in a crash etc. Not that hard to come up with some plausible explanation.

You judge from what you have. We can't play this "we don't know enough" game ad infinitum because then we'd have to withhold comments until release, and you can't change anything anymore after release.

Now that we have some basic design concepts I agree. I am hoping Bethesda can be influenced to change their design a bit, especially in regards to not having a party, that is a real sore point for me.

 

[guenthar]

Crashing a car is different than shooting a car and the people who made the car would try to protect it from crashes. When you shoot the car it could get bettween what is protecting the reactor and cause it to blow up.

 

[BillSeurer]

However, I feel uneasy with the reference to the factual name.

As a resident of the USA I object to Fallout taking place there using factual place names.

 

[curiously undead]

as a resident of the usa i object to people making our country look like one big bumper stick on the back of a ford pickup.

 

[curiously undead]

using a name like that is bad taste but that lack of descretion isn't shocking coming from bethesda. but i acknowledge i have no knowledge of what context it was used in, its possible it could be used to show the horrors of the name. but would it be in good taste if a game used auschwitz or manzanar to describe a village where you could kill npcs...clearly even with shades of grey there are some lines that all should see as red-as in stop

 

[xSamhainx]

I think taking place on the east coast is a great idea personally. If the game works and is fun, if the 14 skills are actually good, etc., the zip code is not going to matter much. Besides, If anyone was going to be safe and comfy in an underground vault (with a case of backup water chips) while the world smolders above, it's the Top Dogs and Fat Cats in Washington and their familia. And a few thousand of their secret service lackeys of course.
Think about it, a new rival post-apocalyptic military order based out of Washington DC proper, the Brotherhood of Steal. *cymbal crash*

 

[Unre]

What on earth are you talking about?!?!?! It is the name of a weapon nothing more.

Should all games be prohibited from using weapons called "AK-47's"? AK-47's have killed far more people than "fatman" did.

Ludicrous argument.

Somewhere on Earth, it is not ludicrous at all. I just have my own reasons. However, I'll refrain myself here.

 

[Asbjoern]

I did find the quest variety in Oblivion better than MW but still arrow-linear and without choice, so perhaps their writing shows some signs. We'll see.

Yes, you're quite right. The quest writing were one of the more positive sides of Oblivion.
In Morrowind your quest was to kill some rats in someone's basement, whereas in Oblivion you killed the lions that was killing the rats in the basement, investigated who was behind the lions in the basement and the last part of the quest was in cooperation with a hunter where you were given the task to go out and kill the source of the lions outside of town.
The music and the way many of the quests were executed was for me the better part of Oblivion. But the lack of dialogues and choices had far greater negative impact on the "questing" in Oblivion.

 

[kalniel]

- Battle system is called the Vault-tec Assisted Targeting System (V.A.T.S.). The article states. “While you’ll certainly be able to tackle enemies in real time using first person shooting, V.A.T.S. lets players pause time and select a target at their leisure”. Battle system still uses action points, but once you’ve used them up you’ll still be able to fight targets in real time while they charge back up.

Clever. Space hulk anyone?

 

[GhanBuriGhan]

Clever. Space hulk anyone?

Not really. Space Hulk (only played the boardgame) was about using a limited time to organize squad based tactics. Doesn't apply to a single player combat, nor is the pause limited.

I just can't imagine a consistent gameplay based on what we know so far:

I.e. I see a bunch of supermutants coming at me. I change to VATS, with, e.g. 8 AP in my account. I select one mutant and select a targeted shot to the head for 5 AP. Is the action actually carried out while I am in VATS, or only after I have allocated all my AP, do I watch my character perform the action (a la KOTOR)? If so, when do I get control over my character back and how do I know? Can I use the remaining 3 to move like in FO, or go prone before VATS turn ends? If so, what happens now? Do the mutants move in turns as in FO1? Do they move as a group in a normal RT way, i.e. do enemies only move in RT? If so, does it make sense if I can do more than one action while in VATS mode? AFter exiting VATS, I apparently need to recharge my AP in real time by not fighting. So I circle strafe and bunnyhop until my AP recharges to do more VATS shots? Or I fight in RT AP recharge very slow, and probably VATS is a once per fight deal?

 

[kalniel]

Not really. Space Hulk (only played the boardgame) was about using a limited time to organize squad based tactics. Doesn't apply to a single player combat, nor is the pause limited.

I do indeed refer to the computer game. As you played in real time you built up a counter which enabled you to switch into a paused mode - the pause mode slowly ate away at the counter until it ran out, throwing you back into real time, usually just as genestealers popped out of somewhere you forgot to cover It worked remarkably well.

In F3's case I can see the pause mode running out simply by doing things that require APs, rather than running out of it's own accord.

 

[GhanBuriGhan]

In F3's case I can see the pause mode running out simply by doing things that require APs, rather than running out of it's own accord.

The boardgame is very similar, only you are timed by the opposing team playing the genestealers. And the time limit makes a huge difference. The cool thing about space hulk is the panic of feeling that timer run out. This is missing from VATS by all accounts, so I am not sure why you feel its more similar to that than to any old RTwP. Nor would it be in line with the TB combat in FO if the time limit were in , incidentally.

 

[Dhruin]

I.e. I see a bunch of supermutants coming at me. I change to VATS, with, e.g. 8 AP in my account. I select one mutant and select a targeted shot to the head for 5 AP. Is the action actually carried out while I am in VATS, or only after I have allocated all my AP, do I watch my character perform the action (a la KOTOR)? If so, when do I get control over my character back and how do I know? Can I use the remaining 3 to move like in FO, or go prone before VATS turn ends? If so, what happens now? Do the mutants move in turns as in FO1? Do they move as a group in a normal RT way, i.e. do enemies only move in RT? If so, does it make sense if I can do more than one action while in VATS mode? AFter exiting VATS, I apparently need to recharge my AP in real time by not fighting. So I circle strafe and bunnyhop until my AP recharges to do more VATS shots? Or I fight in RT AP recharge very slow, and probably VATS is a once per fight deal?

These are exactly my questions. From the limited explanation so far, bunny hopping and circle-strafing while the APs recharge is exactly what I picture. Although, I can't believe any modern develop would do that, so I just don't get it at the moment.

 

[Corwin]

Perhaps we should create a list of these questions and send it over to Beth and see if they'll reply. They might look at us favourably!!

 

[abbaon]

These are exactly my questions. From the limited explanation so far, bunny hopping and circle-strafing while the APs recharge is exactly what I picture. Although, I can't believe any modern develop would do that, so I just don't get it at the moment.

I'm envisioning cover-and-fire tactics, because it's particularly easy for an AI programmer to nullify the advantages of bunny hopping to avoid hitscan weapons. The trick is actually getting the bots to miss like a human being would. With FO3, they could make a proper attack roll every time an enemy targets you, factoring in how much you're obscured, the light level, his perception, whatever. So all they'd need to do is not care whether you're jumping.

 

[BillSeurer]

Yes, you're quite right. The quest writing were one of the more positive sides of Oblivion.
In Morrowind your quest was to kill some rats in someone's basement, whereas in Oblivion you killed the lions that was killing the rats in the basement, investigated who was behind the lions in the basement and the last part of the quest was in cooperation with a hunter where you were given the task to go out and kill the source of the lions outside of town.

You missed something here, though. This whole quest was a parody of that quest back in Morrowind.

 

[Dhruin]

I'm envisioning cover-and-fire tactics, because it's particularly easy for an AI programmer to nullify the advantages of bunny hopping to avoid hitscan weapons. The trick is actually getting the bots to miss like a human being would. With FO3, they could make a proper attack roll every time an enemy targets you, factoring in how much you're obscured, the light level, his perception, whatever. So all they'd need to do is not care whether you're jumping.

I didn't quite understand, so I'll rephrase.

What am I doing while my APs recharge and I can use VATS again?

 

[bjon045]

Somewhere on Earth, it is not ludicrous at all. I just have my own reasons. However, I'll refrain myself here.

It is ludicrous everywhere. It is a factual name. Do people who have family members killed by a drunk driver stop using cars and ride everywhere on bicycles!!!

By your logic we should remove the name "fatman" from all history books? Should they have not mentioned it in the recent film/documentary about Hiroshima/Nagasaki? Of course they should have because it is the name of the weapon.

I suggest you never turn on TV or listen to the radio or use your computer, you might see/hear something that offends you.

 

[Unre]

It is ludicrous everywhere. It is a factual name. Do people who have family members killed by a drunk driver stop using cars and ride everywhere on bicycles!!!

By your logic we should remove the name "fatman" from all history books? Should they have not mentioned it in the recent film/documentary about Hiroshima/Nagasaki? Of course they should have because it is the name of the weapon.

I suggest you never turn on TV or listen to the radio or use your computer, you might see/hear something that offends you.

I have heard/read the name quite a lot of time from various sources including survivors. I feel uneasy because an American game company put it in a game just for a "taste".

However, of course this is far of topic and too much atopic for a game forum.

You may continue with your "logic" but it won't change my opinion on this issue.

 

[curiously undead]

well speaking of words ever time i see the word bangkok i always think of this song...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lMsgrDY5W0
(not intended as an insult, just my associating brain at work, leading to a smile)